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Why Are People Even Complaining Inquisitors Are Weak?


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#61 NuXuN

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 07:45 PM

low sa
slow casting
and sliding step too fast (mad)

#62 PIIIKACHU

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 07:48 PM

well ako has seen most class in 1v1 rooms (been on here fur liek whole day lololol)

yet no a single sight of 1v1 priest

but ako wont be on fur teh nite so maybe all teh 1v1 priest only get on during teh nite


btw yo above arguement is aboot pve which prolly can be offset with grossly powderful eq weee (thou ako tinks majesty has da uppar hand in pvp against em)

as much as ako wans to argue wit sum logic ako is tired arguing ma point of view frum 24 all da way till nao wew
even thou as much as i wanz to show yo my vintage point frum an "experienced/weathered" priest there is no other way othar than trying it out yoself

unless does wanz to cum out here to show us how op we r (clap)  but i tink otherwise still

above just ma thought no other priest included lol thou extremely biased my point of view is, it is the first person perspective :D

#63 Done60

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 08:45 PM

View Postraveyy, on 08 June 2013 - 07:36 PM, said:

Again, I don't think having low SA is a good excuse that Inquisitor is indeed 'weak' nor a good justification for them to be further 'buffed' for PvP.

Going by that logic, Majesty and their skills have low SA in general, Tempest have low SA in general as well. So should their SA be buffed as well? Or the developer have to give everyone Iron Skin before the whole PvP shit can be 'balanced'?

Its all about how you cast your skill in situation, Consecration is meant to be casted as a combo in 1v1 after down-ing a target with shield blow or stuff, not just simply praying for miracle by casting it while an EL is charging her fireball at you, that's just bullcrap.

If you want to justify that a class is bad for certain purposes, do it with proper logic, for example, Majesty being severely underpowered to the point whereby they are a pure utility class as compared to their counterpart Smasher in PvE due to rational justification and reasonable points.

This has gone far enough, at first, I thought it would be a healthy discussion, but more ridiculous reasoning like 'low SA' and 'slow casting' has shown up together with their biased opinions on Inquisitor. That's not a justification for a class that is weak, that is manipulating and emphasizing on the cons of a class while TOTALLY neglecting their pros.

I mean, seriously guys, what is this? I expected a better debate with regards to this topic. One does not simply point out a cons irrationally and keep attacking on that fact itself over and over again with no regards to their pros.

You know, you should give more benefit of the doubt on other players when it comes to "casting skills in situation" and common sense in general. Really, and I mean REALLY! One does not have to be a genius in order to figure out these things.

And let me refer you to my post before your post. I think you missed it.

PS: I am with you on how Majesties are being left out by Smashers.

Edited by Done60, 08 June 2013 - 08:49 PM.


#64 Lawyered

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 09:05 PM

View PostDone60, on 08 June 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

You know, you should give more benefit of the doubt on other players when it comes to "casting skills in situation" and common sense in general. Really, and I mean REALLY! One does not have to be a genius in order to figure out these things.

And let me refer you to my post before your post. I think you missed it.

PS: I am with you on how Majesties are being left out by Smashers.

The benefit of the doubt should be given to the developers... that is they know how to balance DN PVP as a whole. The benefit of doubt should never be resolved in favor of the player's skill, as the latter is imbued with a lot of human factor whereas balancing the game is much more paramount. By simple deduction we should be able to deduce that if you tweak one class, necessarily they have to tweak other classes too.

You guys might think me and ravey are anti-Inquisitor or something, that we are not supportive of your petitions or calls for more buffs, SA to the Priest class. If there would be a dire need to call for the attention of the developers we would gladly join you guys in unison. But that should always come after we as a community have an intelligent discussion about it, and depending on the reasonableness to call for it.

I know for a fact that we love the Inquisitor class as much as you guys and I dare not dream of the day when all your whims and wishes would come true, and for the Inquisitor class to be the new face roll class. Give us more SA, and we would be already in danger of crossing the line between balance and being OP. Who wants to win because of OP shizz anyway. (oo;)

Edited by Lawyered, 08 June 2013 - 09:08 PM.


#65 raveyy

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 09:07 PM

View PostDone60, on 08 June 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

You know, you should give more benefit of the doubt on other players when it comes to "casting skills in situation" and common sense in general. Really, and I mean REALLY! One does not have to be a genius in order to figure out these things.

And let me refer you to my post before your post. I think you missed it.

PS: I am with you on how Majesties are being left out by Smashers.

Well with regards to your first paragraph, if its hard to use, that means that either the player using it is bad (mainly conflict in the player's playstyle versus the class' natural playstyle), or the learning curve of the class is generally harder just like FU during 32/40 cap.

Of course, I'm looking at it rationally since I'm listing out both pros and cons, no doubt they are much slower in terms of casting, low SA and stuff but what I can say is electrocution is one of the most deadly and irritating debuff which allows the Inquisitor to have many window to chain their combo or attacks.

My reply to someone who said that CL has shiit damage - It has a perfect utility of homing projectile and a decent rage + electrocution which can be potentially devastating so its fair enough I guess.

P.S. Thank you and I love the style of inquisitor in PvP as well, really like PvPing using Inquisitor more than Tempest, so please don't get my ideas wrong :D Peace~

Edited by raveyy, 08 June 2013 - 09:08 PM.


#66 kirinfang

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 09:15 PM

I find inquisitors really overpowered in group PvP, it has 2 heals,tank as hell all their skills take no to little effort to land while dealing still insane damage, while you have low SA I wouldn't think you would easily get focused down if you have half decent team mates .

CL has shiat damage but do you know how annoying it is to have that debuff on an engagement? You have low SA but your lightning debuff interrupts people from casting skills how is that not fair? You can basically have a chance to cancel a few skills on every of the opponent that got hit.

The only thing they are not overpowered yet are 1v1 , saint are also in the same boat while inquis have an upper hand.

#67 lagraser

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 10:30 PM

I think many are getting a misunderstanding....

Inquisitors aren't OP and aren't weak....you could say they are in the middle or just a little below the middle....

Inquisitors are shining in PVP, not because they have OP skills..but because of how annoying they can be and how they can control the movement of the enemy.....CL ex can't do sht damage...they just spread out electrocution w/c is really annoying specially for those magic class comboers....consecration can push back enemies and can even kill many enemies if allowed to place it under those who are fighting...BUT, they can't do it by themselves...Inquisitors CAN'T change the tide by themselves, they can't charge ahead...nor they can lead the team towaards the enemy base....they always need back-ups so they can place their skills properly and not be canceled...

Did these people used a priest or rather inqui before? Tell me if you can easily charge towards the enemy...or place your skills properly and kill many w/o the back-up of your teammates....

Inquis aren't good or rather placed below middle in 1v1....how hard is it to even fight a priest/inqui? You just need to pressure them...so they won't be able to cast their skills...fast attacks and the slow of elestras are bane to inquis...as if they can just easily land consecration and as if you will allow yourself to step on consecration all the time...

My challenge is...go play inqui BOTH in 1v1 and group pvp and then go judge this class


----

also, go tell us how you feel while being comboed and your HP getting half already w/o you even doing much damage..and your evasion skills are all used up

Edited by lagraser, 08 June 2013 - 10:33 PM.


#68 lagraser

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 10:44 PM

Oh btw...im from westwood and haven't experienced being banned from the room because i'm a priest...though time to time, I see a room which doesn't allow priests

#69 SaitoHikari

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 01:04 AM

View PostLawyered, on 08 June 2013 - 03:16 PM, said:

But I disagree with Priests as being top tier PVP class caliber- might be able to compete with the top tiered ones but, the difference between acrobat or warriors in terms of skill tree ammunition as compared to the other classes is just too cognizable to ignore. (sorry)

Eh, I've played just about every class to level 50. I see what you're saying on this point.

I don't know about SM since it looks like they have to go either pure PvP or PvE because magic side of the tree after Cyclone sucks for PvP and there's zero point in picking up parries for PvP anymore. But I know what you mean regarding Acrobats and Mercenaries.

"Hurr let's make half the Acrobat and Mercenary skills only cost 1 SP to learn, so that they can learn everything and still max half their skills while all the other classes can only max like a third at the most while still being forced to drop some skills entirely!"

(To this day, I still don't get the logic of just about everything in the middle of the Acrobat tree only costing 1 SP, especially short bow mastery. Whereas Sharpshooter's fake shot, tumbling shot, and bow/crossbow mastery still cost 3 SP to learn.

Pretty much everything on the right side of the Mercenary tree, which consist mostly of buffs and debuffs, only cost 1 SP to learn. Not to mention that Mercenary skills in general have massive damage growth for low SP investment, and lower levels needed to max on top of that. And yet somehow, our buffs and Mind Snapper also cost 3 SP to learn.)

It's why some people in NA laugh at the idea of Acrobats and Mercenaries having a PvP build, because both classes had been considered faceroll enough for so long and have such flexibility in their builds that pretty much any member of those classes can succeed in PvP regardless of build.

Edited by SaitoHikari, 09 June 2013 - 01:07 AM.


#70 GLmaxcombo

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 01:39 AM

View PostSaitoHikari, on 09 June 2013 - 01:04 AM, said:

Eh, I've played just about every class to level 50. I see what you're saying on this point.

I don't know about SM since it looks like they have to go either pure PvP or PvE because magic side of the tree after Cyclone sucks for PvP and there's zero point in picking up parries for PvP anymore. But I know what you mean regarding Acrobats and Mercenaries.

"Hurr let's make half the Acrobat and Mercenary skills only cost 1 SP to learn, so that they can learn everything and still max half their skills while all the other classes can only max like a third at the most while still being forced to drop some skills entirely!"

(To this day, I still don't get the logic of just about everything in the middle of the Acrobat tree only costing 1 SP, especially short bow mastery. Whereas Sharpshooter's fake shot, tumbling shot, and bow/crossbow mastery still cost 3 SP to learn.

Pretty much everything on the right side of the Mercenary tree, which consist mostly of buffs and debuffs, only cost 1 SP to learn. Not to mention that Mercenary skills in general have massive damage growth for low SP investment, and lower levels needed to max on top of that. And yet somehow, our buffs and Mind Snapper also cost 3 SP to learn.)

It's why some people in NA laugh at the idea of Acrobats and Mercenaries having a PvP build, because both classes had been considered faceroll enough for so long and have such flexibility in their builds that pretty much any member of those classes can succeed in PvP regardless of build.
slightly getting off topic... (:])









anyway from my point of view:

inquisitor:

Group PvP = Abyss mode
     1v1        = Super duper Hardcore Mode

#71 PIIIKACHU

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 08:10 AM

did someone just said LETS TRUST THE KOREAN DEVELOPERS WITH BALANCE

LOL@DATSHET

#72 chihaya

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 08:30 AM

View PostPIIIKACHU, on 09 June 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

did someone just said LETS TRUST THE KOREAN DEVELOPERS WITH BALANCE

LOL@DATSHET
There goes my favorite inqui (lol) (one)
Pls don't press deto sir (:[)

Edited by chihaya, 09 June 2013 - 08:30 AM.


#73 wolf999

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 08:33 AM

View PostPIIIKACHU, on 09 June 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

did someone just said LETS TRUST THE KOREAN DEVELOPERS WITH BALANCE

LOL@DATSHET

idol awww.... show ur brown hairy nieps

#74 Lawyered

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 08:36 AM

View PostPIIIKACHU, on 09 June 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

did someone just said LETS TRUST THE KOREAN DEVELOPERS WITH BALANCE

LOL@DATSHET

I think the words used were "to give them the benefit of the doubt" not Trust. (tense)

#75 PIIIKACHU

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 09:00 AM

ako frum 24 till nao

only tink its going downhill

from both service and pvp balance


even thou ako keeping cool but ako has to say ako feels strongly fur tis part
(ako maybe abit too high expect on second thought)

Edited by PIIIKACHU, 09 June 2013 - 09:02 AM.


#76 insidious0192

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 09:43 AM

Inquis are not OP
They are annoying (mad)

#77 desofire

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 11:10 AM

Priests have low SA, barely any reliable escape mechanism other than slide and aerial evasion, and the amount of damage depends on how they can survive.

In Ladder, since softban is not followed at all, that is where Priests are technically free to do as they please... but they are still burdened by their low SA and other forms of escape mechanism.

#78 acidkobe

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 11:28 AM

View Postraveyy, on 07 June 2013 - 07:48 PM, said:

Lol, priest not strong?

One heal = 25% HP, one Healing relic = 6% per tick x 4

Chain Lightning = Noob-friendly skill, you can just simply cast it since its a homing projectile skill.

They are one of the lowest learning curve with the highest potential right now in T4 PvP, be it 1v1 or Team PvP.

Pver and a ladderer.

#79 PayrPaks

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 12:53 PM

Because we Inquisitors are weak in PvP, 1 v 1 PvP specifically.

Count the number of Inquisitors in Ladder that reached 2000 rating, then count the number of this x job that reached 2000 rating. You'll see that this x job will always be greater in number compared to Inquisitors.

It's hard playing an Inquisitor in 1 v 1 PvP. It has a HIGH learning curve. Do you really think it's all about Chain Lightning and then bam bam bam dead enemy? Haha. Wrong. You just made yourself known to the general public that you are a poor judge of character.

Sure, Chain Lightning / Chain Lightning EX has homing capabilities. Sure, it has electrocution debuff that paralyzes you every 4 seconds. "Imbalanced", right?

WRONG. DEAD WRONG.

Homing capabilities, so what? It deals 500-1000 damage per hit in Comp On / Ladder. Electrocution debuff? Easy. Count 4 seconds and then stop whatever you're doing.

To be honest, I don't really get why people complain about the electrocution debuff and why is it "imbalanced", WHEN IT'S THE EASIEST DEBUFF TO COUNTER.

Can you counter Freeze / Slow? No. Unless you're a Priest.

Can you counter Fire / DPS? No. Unless, again, you're a Priest.

Can you counter Poison? No. Unless, for the third time now, you're a Priest.

Can you counter Electrocution? YES! EVEN IF YOU ARE NOT A PRIEST! You just need to learn how to count to 4! Don't know how to count? Why are you even playing this game?

---

Case in point: I admit that I'm complaining and QQ-ing, but for a good cause. It's hard to play as an Inquisitor.

If someone tells you that he is an Inquisitor and he is dominating in 1 v 1 PvP, laugh at him. He's clearly making a joke.

Unless he's Warau. But then again, even him, my current master in the art of PvP-ing, says that playing Inquisitors in 1 v 1 PvP is hard.

Edited by PayrPaks, 09 June 2013 - 12:54 PM.


#80 Lawyered

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 01:00 PM

View Postdesofire, on 09 June 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

Priests have low SA, barely any reliable escape mechanism other than slide and aerial evasion, and the amount of damage depends on how they can survive.

In Ladder, since softban is not followed at all, that is where Priests are technically free to do as they please... but they are still burdened by their low SA and other forms of escape mechanism.

Well, maybe just maybe, Priests were not destined or envisioned to have the same evasive, high SA or epic Burst damage as other classes. Maybe we were just meant to be just Priests? Not some made up fictional superman Priest who can do everything and anything from High SA, Heal, Burst damage, Multiple evasive maneuvers.

I don't know when these argument would end.. but IMHO there is already proper equilibrium of the distribution and allocation of skills that have been given to the Priest class. We have enough defensive skills to last and win in PVP. To further my contention, I think it's better for us to have a breakdown of our skills particularly on our defensive capabilities in PVP, whether actually used by the player or not:

Cleric Tree:
1. Block
Please do not argue that once this skill is used, any other successive skills cast would be interrupted when Block is actually triggered by the opponent, the logic to debunk such claim would be the same argument that can be said for the low SA of Consecration, There is always a proper time to cast the skill, and the chances of the skill to be cast to be interrupted or cancelled is more of the exception than the general rule. (oo;)

Utility: Can block 2 attacks up to 12 attacks depending on the skill level of the user.

2. Heal

Utility: Can heal back up to 17% of the User's HP. This skill is almost instant cast, if you still complain about low SA, I really don't know what is the problem with you.

3. Toughness

Utility: Decreases Physical damage taken by 10%

Here is one fact that a lot of people fail to consider.. It is only the Cleric tree to which the Priest class belongs that has this damage reduction passive. Take note I said Passive, not activated or toggled. (tense)

4. Holy Bolt

Utility: Can hold or paralyze the enemy from 1.0 to 2.5 seconds depending on the skill level of the user.

Seriously, this hold skill... you not only have one chance for it to land. You in fact have two chances for it to land. The initial bolt, and then subsequently the follow up AOE bolt. It's just a matter of practice for the aiming part of it. If you argue about how hard for it is to be aimed or the low SA then (oo;)

Priest Tree
5. Bind Relic

Utility: This skill at level 6 can bind the enemy for 2 seconds at least 6 times in 24 seconds on a 4 second Interval. Understand? This means that when an opponent is caught in the first bind.. after the effect wears off, he only has 2 seconds to run outside its range or Invi-frame it in order to avoid the next bind.

6. Vengeance Blast

Utility: This is an instant cast skill that breaks most SA of the enemy.

7. Healing Relic

Utility: Heals and more Heals

8. Chain Lightning or the paralyze/ immobilized status in general

Utility: self explanatory. Although the shock effect can be predictable, still 1 mistake by the enemy then his skill is cancelled by itself without any active part on the Priest.

9. Cure Relic

Utility: removes status effect in 6, 3 second intervals for 18 seconds. Which means that if ever cure relic is cast right, the maximum status debuff that could last on you is only 3 seconds until the next wave would come. Mix this up with high HP, and high Def, we could withstand a lot of hits!

9. First Aid

Utility: Well it's not our fault no one or rarely anyone uses this skill. It's no reason not to include it in the list for defensive skills that could be utilized by the Priest class in general.

10. Relic dropping SA breaking ability

We may lack obvious evasive, Invi frame or high SA ability, but we definitely do not lack what it takes to counter other classes or to win against them.