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Flurry Pve Guide For Cap 93


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#21 FirePhoenix

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 11:11 AM

Dark EJC vs Pure patk.

In this post, I will do some analysis about this problem. Notice that, this analysis can also apply to other class using ECJ.

Firstly, how our dmg is calculated. In a simplifed form:
Dmg = (ATK * Skill board dmg %) * (1 + ele attack %) * (1 - ele resist %)
Here we want to compare between different gears, we can obmit skill board dmg part.
Dmg = ATK * (1 + ele attack %) * (1 - ele resist %)

I will compare among 3 set up:
Gear 1: neck and earring tough. Dark ECJ
Gear 2: neck Skewer, earring tough. Dark ECJ
Gear 3: Neck and earring skill, Non ECJ.
Here is snapshot of my stat in those setup
Posted Image
Using above damage formular for these 3 gear, we have:
Posted Image
For detail boss dark resist in nest, you can check here.
Some observations:
-  Dual tough (Gear1) vs. Neck Skewer + earring tough (Gear2)
Gear1 have 4% dmg output more than Gear2.
However using neck skewer make this skill from: 1455% > 1656% ~ 13.8% increase. Skewer is our main source of DPS, so Gear2 will better Gear1 when flurry want go Dark ECJ.
- At 0% ele resist. Dark ECJ is much better than Pure ATK.
- In RDN, most boss have 15% dark resist, some have 0% dark resist.
At 15% resist, dark ECJ is slight weaker. But after apply debuff and for some boss have 0% dark resist, Dark is much stronger. So overall, Dark ECJ is better for RDN.
- In Nest 90, boss have 30% dark resist.
At 30% dark resist, Dark ECJ is much weaker.
In party we can lower dark resist to 10%, in this case, Dark ECJ with 2 tough has higher dmg output, but with 1 tough is almost the same.
My conclusion for Dark ECJ in nest 90 is:
- For flurry, don't bother.
- For other Dark ECJ class using 2 tough, you can use Dark ECJ if you can sync well with - Ele resist debuff. But the increment is small, and it not consider effect of +1skill on neck/ear. So it up to your choice.

Edited by FirePhoenix, 05 December 2015 - 04:12 PM.


#22 fourrier

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 11:23 AM

That -5% dark resist column is kinda funny. Why the non-ele damage is increased to 154231 ?

#23 FirePhoenix

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 11:30 AM

^
Fixed.

#24 CzadeQuiber

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Posted 04 December 2015 - 11:35 PM

but lancea skills are nerfed this 90 cap. (T.T)

#25 FirePhoenix

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Posted 05 December 2015 - 09:42 AM

View PostCzadeQuiber, on 04 December 2015 - 11:35 PM, said:

but lancea skills are nerfed this 90 cap. (T.T)
No they are not. If you check my table, you will see it clearly.
From wave 1 - Cap 90, flurry get a huge boost, after that they get nerf a bit. Afterall still a boost compare to 80.

#26 lexlexlex

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Posted 05 December 2015 - 07:11 PM

my crit is currently at 57%, whats good enough crit to achieve?

#27 FirePhoenix

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Posted 05 December 2015 - 10:31 PM

View Postlexlexlex, on 05 December 2015 - 07:11 PM, said:

my crit is currently at 57%, whats good enough crit to achieve?
Typically, I think we need 75-79%, so we can cap crit with archer buff. But now we still at the begining of cap 90, so don't need worry to much about crit.

#28 CzadeQuiber

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 01:25 AM

View PostFirePhoenix, on 05 December 2015 - 09:42 AM, said:

No they are not. If you check my table, you will see it clearly.
From wave 1 - Cap 90, flurry get a huge boost, after that they get nerf a bit. Afterall still a boost compare to 80.

but it says here that skill damage was reduced.. (:[)

http://dn.cherrycred...alancing-lancea

#29 FirePhoenix

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Posted 08 December 2015 - 09:54 AM

View PostCzadeQuiber, on 08 December 2015 - 01:25 AM, said:

but it says here that skill damage was reduced.. (:[)

http://dn.cherrycred...alancing-lancea
CC always bad at patch note. They copy patch note from kDN. From wave 1 to wave 3 Flurry get nerf. But compare to cap 80, flurry get boost.

#30 XaelCry

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Posted 10 December 2015 - 12:17 PM

View PostFirePhoenix, on 08 December 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

CC always bad at patch note. They copy patch note from kDN. From wave 1 to wave 3 Flurry get nerf. But compare to cap 80, flurry get boost.
Are there going to bit a slight nerf later? my flurry already weak due using undergeared set, then a nerf would making her more weak (sweat)

#31 fourrier

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Posted 10 December 2015 - 01:31 PM

There's no difference between our version of Flurry with the one in kDN atm.
Flurry is a better DPS than she was in 80 cap.

#32 daichishred0

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Posted 12 December 2015 - 07:55 AM

OH MY GOD> 140k atk... plus a real senpai... its my 16th day of playing DN and i laid my eyes on flurry instantly..

i dont care what others say and im gonna stay to flurry till the end.. q.q ive geared her up very well and now shes wearing full RDN normal set but only has 78k ATK.. what is your server? can i be your apprentice? Q.Q i really love flurry !!!

#33 Restrepia

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Posted 13 December 2015 - 06:38 AM

hi, thank you very much about a very detail guide.
I would like to discuss more about the Spinning Skewer cd or dmg.

this is your calculation on paper

Quote

Let say Skewer have 8200% board and the flurry have 10% FD.
Case 1: CD plate. Skewer have cd 5.6s. Total FD after EP: 10% + 65% = 75%.
8200% > 8200% * 1.75 = 14350% (after EP) cd 5.6 s > DPS = 14350/5.6 = 2562%
Case 2: Dmg plate. FD after EP and Plate is 10% + 65% +20% = 95%.
8200% > 8200 %* 1.95 = 15990% (after EP and dmg plate) cd 7s > DPS = 15990% / 7 = 2284%

but in practice, you cannot always use Spinning Skewer exactly when the cd off. I want to modify a little bit in your formula

Quote

8200% > 8200% * 1.75 = 14350% (after EP) cd 5.6 s > DPS = 14350/(5.6+x) < 2562%

x is the time you need to use skills to re-apply the weak point, because

Quote

@FirePhoenix- Unguarded Point cannot be refreshed. Can only reapply after debuff goes off.
if you failed to re-apply the weak point within 1.4s and poke the Skewer, then you waste the cd plate.

In practical, we cannot stay near the boss all the time to trigger the weak point and use Skewer immediately, there are always small margins time to proc weak point, move to correct position and use Skewer. imo, i cannot say the cd plate always superior than dmg plate, especially when we face mobility bosses which we need to chase, huge damaged boss which we need to dodge.

#34 fourrier

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Posted 13 December 2015 - 11:55 AM

View PostRestrepia, on 13 December 2015 - 06:38 AM, said:

if you failed to re-apply the weak point within 1.4s and poke the Skewer, then you waste the cd plate.

In practical, we cannot stay near the boss all the time to trigger the weak point and use Skewer immediately, there are always small margins time to proc weak point, move to correct position and use Skewer. imo, i cannot say the cd plate always superior than dmg plate, especially when we face mobility bosses which we need to chase, huge damaged boss which we need to dodge.
Well, I don't quite agree it being "wasted".

Spinning Skewer without vulnerable has crappy damage in 80 cap, but the story is different in 90 cap.
It even has considerably better damage compared to Shutter Bounce and Stab Screw.
So I don't view the CD plate as the tool of "I can do 1 more spinning skewer in this burst window" because well... burst window no longer exist.
But instead, I use it so my lowest CD skill can go even lower, so I can use it more often as filler (1.4k~1.6k for a 5.6s skill is quite respectable)

ADD :
Also, having CD plate is not about spamming them as soon as they are available too. This is quite a special case for Flurry.

Let's take a look at this case :
You cast spinning skewer on a target without vulnerable status, Skewer goes CD, but your next hit on 1s after the CD starts trigger a vulnerable status.
In 80 cap, you'll just forget the idea about hitting them with Skewer even if you have CD plate.
However, in 90 cap, it's still possible to take that vulnerable status if you do have the plate, but not possible if you don't.
The reason is the vulnerable status duration is 5s as opposed to 2s in 80 cap. You have more time to reposition yourself and more time for Skewer to complete its CD.

If we assume it takes 0.3s for Skewer to thrust the target after you trigger the skill, then as long as vulnerable status is triggered 0.9s after your last skewer, you can always can still hit it with vulnerable status intact. Without CD plate, the number becomes 2.3s. I think this the biggest deal about choosing CD plate in 90 cap.

Edited by fourrier, 13 December 2015 - 12:07 PM.


#35 FirePhoenix

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Posted 13 December 2015 - 12:21 PM

Cap 90 come with 2 advantage:
- SB skill tree can trigger Vulnerable. Most important is hovering blade. So it quite easy to trigger Vulnerable now.
- Vulnerable now last 5s. Make Flurry life much more conformtable.

View PostRestrepia, on 13 December 2015 - 06:38 AM, said:

if you failed to re-apply the weak point within 1.4s and poke the Skewer, then you waste the cd plate.
This is not true. We have more than 1.4s. In most case, we don't use Skewer immediately after see Vulnerable. There are many reason for that: waiting for buff/debuff, finishing current skill (For example, Spining swing), and is many case: waiting for Skewer cd. Because Vulnerable now last 5s, we can afford such delay. Delay will be 2~3s. So after using Skewer, we only wait Vulnerable 1 or 2 s for it wear off, before we reapply debuff again. So we will have 3 or 4s, to reapply debuff while waiting for Skewer off cd. And then if Vulnerable happen in this period of time, we can use Skewer right after it off cd.
Of course, this is a matter of luck, But it has a high change happen like this.

Edited by FirePhoenix, 13 December 2015 - 12:23 PM.


#36 HurriDANCE

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Posted 14 December 2015 - 10:21 PM

Ok. noted that I can spam Spinning Skewer now.
I always held myself back whenever I see the trigger activating.
I got the feeling that it would be gone before I could use another Skewer again.
like .. I use Skewer after the trigger, however, the trigger still lingers in even after skewer is off CD.
This gives me the expression that the trigger would be off before I could use another fatal skewer.
I mean, is 5 seconds over? (crazy)
or the debuff got refreshed? (crazy)

With that, I wanna ask if the status stacks/refreshes or not?

#37 FirePhoenix

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Posted 15 December 2015 - 02:46 AM

^ I am not so sure about this, but base on my observation, It does not refresh.

#38 fourrier

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Posted 15 December 2015 - 08:58 AM

If it can be refreshed, then I should be able to notice some occasions where the debuff last longer than 5 seconds.
Nope, I didn't notice any.

#39 Erui

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 12:51 PM

90 cap is here and still, I can't find the right plates (tense)

#40 ArmedAndReady

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 01:24 PM

View PostErui, on 17 December 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:

90 cap is here and still, I can't find the right plates (tense)

The plates from heraldy scholar are now cheap :) (around 300 dimensional fragments if I'm not mistaken). Get -CD for stab screw, lollipop chups and skewer. Action speed for spinning swing.