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[T5/3R Guide] Guardians - That Others May Live [Pve Pure Support / Hp-Stacking Guardian] - Now With Video Evidence Of Gf Being Fixed


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#261 ShUnT

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 12:59 PM

Do I need Conviction Aura to perform spinning the s1 boss in IDN successfully? Because I forgot to take it.

#262 Riuga

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 02:09 PM

View PostShUnT, on 07 April 2017 - 12:59 PM, said:

Do I need Conviction Aura to perform spinning the s1 boss in IDN successfully? Because I forgot to take it.

No. You do not need Conviction Aura for anything. You don't need to phrase it as "I forgot", because that implies that it is something you should have taken. 99% of all spinning problems are due to technique (namely running the shortest circle possible around the boss), not because you lack speed. Get a costume for 15% speed, get your 10% speed passive, and get some L-grade shoes for 3.5% speed if you really need it. Also bring a Willpower Fragment, or make sure someone else is bringing one. That is already enough speed. Lastly, you do not need to spin the boss. It is just an overly-glorified practice picked up by (primarily) public parties, which then spread like wildfire to even more public parties and some of the more casual / serious private parties. I've made a detailed post on my stance on spinning the boss in some old thread if you really want to dig it up.

Edited by Riuga, 07 April 2017 - 02:10 PM.


#263 ShUnT

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 09:57 PM

Thank you for reply Sir. I just tried spinning the boss with some volunteer Academic and Saint and let them cast Wax and Cure Relic. It worked fine and I can make the boss spin even without Conviction Aura.

#264 Kyoukasama

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 03:02 PM

Riu, is guardian force buff based of caster's currrent HP or caster's max HP for now? Thx

#265 Riuga

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Posted 10 April 2017 - 01:52 AM

View PostKyoukasama, on 09 April 2017 - 03:02 PM, said:

Riu, is guardian force buff based of caster's currrent HP or caster's max HP for now? Thx

Max HP including buffs.

#266 rikolero

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 11:21 PM

Riuga, I'll be moonlighting as a tank for an alt party in RuDN. Anything that I need to know?

#267 Riuga

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 01:53 AM

View Postrikolero, on 21 April 2017 - 11:21 PM, said:

Riuga, I'll be moonlighting as a tank for an alt party in RuDN. Anything that I need to know?

I can can only tell you this in-game. I am not going to disclose my tanking strategies to the general public until my team clears HC.

Spoiler


#268 Riuga

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Posted 28 April 2017 - 01:44 AM

Now that we've cleared HC, I am no longer bound by the Team's rules of strategy confidentiality. Yours truly will be hosting a Guardian Ask-Me-Anything over the next week. You can ask me anything about Guardians in RuDN HC. I will share some of my own thoughts, tips, and strategies over the next week also.

Q: Are the 30 Mutant Rabbits provokable?
A: No.

Posted Image

Q: Did you really clear RuDN HC with full RDN-L gear?
A: Yes. You have about the same amount of DEF and MDEF as a Gladiator decked out in non-evolved IDN-L. The truth of the matter is that you won't take damage if you can block and dodge properly. I believe few openly embrace the idea of training to perfectionism in order offset less self-survivability (which is why RDN-L isn't that popular even among those who have the funds), but I have proven that it is possible. Full RDN-L does come with benefits. 3.4m GFs can take one or two full hits of the Stage 2 Dark Room charges. This is extremely helpful for some of the more squishy classes.

Q: What is your tanking strategy for Dragon?
A: I like to bait tail swipe and stay at the left hind leg area the entire run unless the tail is aiming at either statue after 5x (in which case I will side-tank until it no longer aims at either statue). This dragon does not like to rotate as much as past dragons when you do this, thus it is arguably safer and clearly beneficial for squeezing in DPS at HC. The problem with front-taking is that it will start doing its Claw Swipe + Leap + Ground Rake / Fire Rings attack, which is far worse than a simple rotation - one which may not even happen once during an entire run. Side-tanking will still cause rotations, thus it is better to do tail-tanking whenever possible as that will contribute DPS windows unlike side-tanking.

Q: Advice for Stage 3?
A: Quit blindly spamming skills. Learn to always anticipate the Laser Mechanic and the Blossoming Poison Circles Mechanic. Those are really the only two things that will screw you over. I honestly do not have a problem with the Pizza Mechanic since I am a programmer and musician. The prior helps train your brain as a whole (not just memorization), and the second gives me a unique way of memorizing the slices. I actually think of the slices as part-melody and part-tablature while singing it in my head. It may sound a bit weird, but it works very well. As for the 1x Pizza in HC, you can either stick near mid and Tumble to the second slice all in one go or Shield Charge in order to avoid the confuse wearing off as you are moving. It's not a bad idea to reserve DA in case you mess up, however there may be times when you won't have DA as a result of the Staff Summoning Mechanic and such.

Q: Advice for Stage 2?
A: Not much. I consider this to be the easiest stage in the raid with the hardest mechanic in the raid (0.5x). You may want to stick to a general position (e.g. upper half / lower half) for the 0.5x Mechanic and get some of the more squishy people to stick near you so that you may shower them with up to 3m or so GFs. Also, avoid standing at 3 o'clock during the 0.5x Mechanic at all costs. There is a weird bug that deals 36m damage or so to you if you stand at that area when the final stomp occurs. There is no visible AoE or anything, just instant death - even if you jump the stomp.

Q: Advice for Stage 1?
A: You should try to signal others to prepare themselves to get out in case you know that the quadrant they are standing on is about to get spiked. You're practically free from having to DPS, thus you can keep an eye out for this better than the others can. Try to lure the boss away if the quadrant it is standing on is next in line to get spiked. It's not a bad idea to GF everyone after the first rabbit is killed during the Bar Mechanic just in case the boss starts attacking the quadrants. Un-plated Kick and Holy Kick is a bit slow during the 1x Bar Mechanic. You may want to abuse Armor Break and Shield Charge to give the ball some extra push. There are many ways to do the Tracing Breath. I'd say suck it up and understand that you will take some hits and burn. It's really not as bad as it sounds. You will recoup the lost HP with one or two perfect SoFs. Ultimately how you do it depends on where the boss is and what the current spiked quadrants are. There are too many scenarios to list down, but generally speaking, coordinate with everyone else, tell them where they should go to and where you will generally go to whenever this mechanic happens. If the boss is at the edge of the map, you should just lure him along the edge of the map. If he is near mid (which is the most common case), get him as close to the edge as possible (be prepared to tank a few hits), then do a last-second turn either CW or CCW in order to avoid pinning yourself between the boss and the wall for up to half a minute. This situation is extremely dangerous if your quadrant gets spiked during this time. Avoid it at all costs. While bringing the boss to the edge, avoid the quadrant that is next in line to be spiked. Remember that the first spiked quadrant is always the upper-right quadrant (relative to the entrance to Stage 2), and in the case of two spiked quadrants, upper-right and bottom-right. The spiked quadrant(s) will rotate clockwise roughly every 15 seconds. Whenever the spikes get completely retracted, the spiked quadrant will start again from the upper-right quadrant. The other various scenarios can be done based off of common sense. I do not advocate using DA unless you're low on HP when this mechanic starts. The problem with DA is that it doesn't solve the problem, it just delays it. Tracing Breath will happen faster than your DA can come off cooldown. As a result, it is critical to know how to do this mechanic without relying on DA. I would rather reserve DA for the rare near-death situations as a result of bugs or lag spikes.

Tip: Heal works on the Phase 1 Blue Wisp, and so do buffs such as AoR and %Damage Reduction. Saint and Physician heals work (the fixed ticks do not), LF heals do not work. AoR the Wisp right off the bat so that the heals from both the blue balls and your Healer heal more. If you hit the mobs (and the big one) at a precise timing during their spawn you can flinch them temporarily to buy everyone else some time. You can also land a JC on some of them to lessen the damage dealt to the ball.

Tip: Laser targeting you in Phase 1 while you have to tank the big rabbit? Reserve either Block or SoF, and stay at the corner of the map to avoid mid. Simply stand still and block the entire laser. It's free bubbles, too. Tell the others not to freak out and if they really need to pass through, they can i-frame past your laser since it is stationary.

Tip: You do not need to dodge the 8-way ground rake at Dragon. Simply i-frame the initial melee explosion and hug the boss. The red lines will not hit you even though it may seem like it.

Tip: If you JC (or get someone else to i-frame; SM's Eclipse works) right before the boss does the rooting mechanic at Stage 2, you can make it so that no one will get knocked back. This gives you more time to burst the boss down. Note that for JC, you will need to Aerial Evade as you will be stuck in the air afterwards. Yes, the green aura will still free you even if you are in the air. Alternatively, you can Escape Location.

Tip: You can make your life a thousand times easier if you just SoF or Block the Flamethrower Balls at Stage 3.

Tip: If you JC on the crossroads right when the Spacebar Mechanic occurs at Stage 1, you can make yourself stuck in the air and not get pushed back, nor will you take spike damage. The uppercut hit will give the boss the debuff, thus you can somehow kill two birds in one stone. This is particularly helpful if you are lagging, experiencing FPS dips during Spacebar Mechanic, or have too much speed from Wax and other buffs and know that you will eat the wall spikes before you can free yourself. Note that you must either Aerial Evade or Escape Location in order to get back on the ground again.

Tip: You can make use of the jade-change time between Stage 1 and 2 by landing perfect SoFs on the Sword Statues. This ensures that you always start the stage with maximum bubbles.

Edited by Riuga, 28 April 2017 - 06:56 AM.


#269 ReidSkyler

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Posted 29 April 2017 - 11:29 PM

(mad) (mad) (mad)  no updates??

#270 Riuga

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 09:03 PM

View PostReidSkyler, on 29 April 2017 - 11:29 PM, said:

(mad) (mad) (mad)  no updates??

I am currently busy with a special project that some of you will enjoy (especially the raider types). If you want to ask me something, feel free to.

Speaking of which, I will be posting an RDN-L versus RuDN-L analysis later this week. Stay tuned.

I'll drop some links while I'm at it.

Full RuDN-L.

Full RDN-L.

I don't think either extreme is ideal. There are some combinations that give better HP:DEF ratios than others, which is what I will discuss later this week.

Edited by Riuga, 01 May 2017 - 01:50 AM.


#271 Riuga

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Posted 02 May 2017 - 08:57 PM

Someone pointed out to me via in-game mail that the Physical Mastery in my item builds is Lv 5. This is an error as the maximum should only be 4. Having said that, since it was applied to both builds, the HP gap is still proportional. The entire point of the item builds was to show the HP gap between the two sets when all other gear is perfect / near-perfect.

Technically, Lv 5 is possible if you have a +1 Skill Plate, however I like to exclude all Cash Shop equipment expansions in all of my past, present, and future comparisons

Edited by Riuga, 02 May 2017 - 09:01 PM.


#272 Dolorem

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Posted 03 May 2017 - 12:11 PM

Hello, new guardian here
Can i ask how "stance of faith" works?
Do you need to hold space to stay in defence state?
Why my defence state is gone, even if i have 10 GB?
And what is parry?
Can someone explain in detail about SOF please.
Sorry for bad english

#273 Riuga

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 12:59 AM

View PostDolorem, on 03 May 2017 - 12:11 PM, said:

Hello, new guardian here
Can i ask how "stance of faith" works?
Do you need to hold space to stay in defence state?
Why my defence state is gone, even if i have 10 GB?
And what is parry?
Can someone explain in detail about SOF please.
Sorry for bad english

You can block an attack within the first 2 seconds or so of casting it. Pressing Spacebar (you do not need to hold Spacebar) will make you go into extended blocking mode. This simply extends the 2 second time window to infinity (as long as you have bubbles; check the skill description for the bubble consumption rate while under extended blocking mode). You gain 5 bubbles if you land a perfect block, however. A perfect block happens when you block an attack within 0.5s of casting SoF. This isn't as hard as it sounds with enough practice. You should always aim to land perfect blocks, and only go into extended blocking mode when you are lagging, not sure when to block, or press SoF too early.

Even under extended blocking mode, you can only block one attack before SoF ends, regardless of your GB count. Extended blocking mode or not, you can technically block an infinite amount of hits so long as the hits happen within 0.5s of each other.

Parry is the SM equivalent of SoF, except they cannot press Spacebar in order to extend it. Anything that you can block with SoF or Block, you can block with Parry.

Edited by Riuga, 04 May 2017 - 01:03 AM.


#274 Riuga

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Posted 10 May 2017 - 01:09 PM

Important note: the following analysis assumes that you have a full set of RDN-L with perfect jades. This is somewhat unrealistic as most Guardians these days do not use a full set of RDN-L, let alone have perfect jades for the entire set. If you truly want to judge RuDN-L compared to your current gear, then use the simulator.

The main problem we face when upgrading to RuDN-L is the 5-piece and 4-piece HP/VIT bonuses of RDN-L. Understand that you will lose HP when upgrading any RDN-L piece to RuDN-L. Upgrading the Upper Body will make you lose 20k HP, in exchange for about 500 more VIT and a load of defense (7% DEF and 9% MDEF). Although your unbuffed HP will be lower, your HP under DP will theoretically be a bit higher. I would say that upgrading the Upper Body is a good choice.

Similarly, upgrading your Lower Body will make you lose 20k HP in exchange for 270 VIT, 5% PDEF, and 6% MDEF. This time, it is not as clear whether or not the VIT increase will outweigh the HP loss under DP. Since the HP loss will be very minimal, I would say that upgrading it to RuDN-L would be a fair exchange.

Beyond this point, we face the problem of the RDN-L set bonuses that give HP and VIT. I do not think that upgrading anything else will be worth it beyond this point, however I will still rank the rest of the upgrades by order of least to most amount of HP/VIT lost: Hat < Shoes < Gloves < Shield < Flail. Upgrading the Hat already makes you lose 70k HP. The Shoes will make you lose 60k HP, however since the Hat gives around 250 more VIT than the Shoes, it would still be a better upgrade overall. The Gloves, Shoes, Flail, and Shield will make you lose both VIT and HP.

The critical problem with upgrading the Shield and Flail is that RDN-L weapons are able to use the old Life Vitality Jades. These jades have a 5% HP bonus on them, in addition to offering almost twice as much VIT compared to Lv 93 Light Jades. You will lose both VIT and HP when upgrading your weapons - around 200k HP per weapon in fact. At that, I find the DEF/MDEF increase from the RuDN-L Shield to be rather insignificant. The increase was far lower than what I expected it to be. I simply do not recommend upgrading the weapons. You are going to be extremely weak when the next raid comes as a result, however it's not like you're really doing any damage now anyway.

In short, you start to get negative returns after upgrading any two pieces of the set. Beyond two pieces, I do not find the HP loss to be justifiable. As such, upgrade the two pieces that are going to give you the most bang for your buck. So which pieces will give the most bang for buck? Clearly, weapons are out of the question, and so are Gloves since Shoes are clearly better. You're going to have to pick 2 of 4 pieces (Upper Body, Lower Body, Hat, and Shoes). Hat is better than Shoes if you factor in DP. Hat will give roughly 4k more HP than Lower Body (DP-compensated), however the Lower Body will give 1% more DEF and 2% more MDEF. I find that the HP loss is extremely insignificant, and would rather take the defense. As such, I currently plan on going with the Upper Body and Lower Body.

I will, however, keep a stash of RuDN-L Wraths just in case the next raid hits extremely hard for whatever reason and I urgently need to upgrade some more of my armor for defense. Clearing RuDN HC with full RDN-L made me realize that as long as your blocking and dodging is very reliable, defense really isn't going to be an issue. I would say that an effective way to measure how sufficient your defense is for the next raid would be to compare your DEF and MDEF to that of a non-INT team member, preferably with say, full RuDN-L gear. The logic is if he can survive the raid with his level of defense, so can you even if your DEF and MDEF are a bit lower than his since you have much more HP than he does.

Edited by Riuga, 10 May 2017 - 01:28 PM.


#275 Riuga

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Posted 14 May 2017 - 12:13 AM

I have obtained my Genesis Earrings today. 5.6m HP in town, 6.6m with just AoR, and 16.865m with maximum self-buffs and an Origin. Hitting 5.7m is going to be very hard and very expensive. After I upgrade one of my rings, which should net me 60-70k HP, I can only upgrade the more expensive items such as my talismans to the Lv 93 variants. I have decided in the past that Epic Talismans are not worth it, thus those are out of the question in my case. My plates are more or less perfect. One must also factor in my future RuDN-L, which will drop my HP by 40k. Quite frankly, I don't think I will hit 5.8m for at least another year or more.

Edited by Riuga, 14 May 2017 - 12:27 AM.


#276 Lalleq

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 09:33 AM

Hi, I'm new. Can I know in what order should I get my RDN-L pieces(eg. Head>Body>Main Weapon)? And in what order should I enhance them? Because I'm buying RDN-L service every week, will take some time to get the full set. I was thinking to get RDN-U for the less important pieces first, then slowly change them to RDN-L according to priority. Thanks in advance. Love your guide! :)

#277 jshak28

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 10:24 AM

Are you using the Racing Costume set? the gloves alone gives 10% HP bonus and Upper can give 8% Vit.

#278 Ameron

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 10:46 AM

Guards can deal decent damage if you're considering the idl/rudl route.

Posted Image
Above, it's my average damage with Overwhelm + click. It can go higher if I get full critical, but it's like DN knows whenever I wanna screenshot.

Posted Image
DPS in RUDN HC.

#279 Riuga

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 03:07 PM

View PostLalleq, on 19 May 2017 - 09:33 AM, said:

Hi, I'm new. Can I know in what order should I get my RDN-L pieces(eg. Head>Body>Main Weapon)? And in what order should I enhance them? Because I'm buying RDN-L service every week, will take some time to get the full set. I was thinking to get RDN-U for the less important pieces first, then slowly change them to RDN-L according to priority. Thanks in advance. Love your guide! :)

Bare in mind that RDN-L will not be as efficient in your case since Lv 80 Jades w/ extra VIT are more or less extinct now. As a result, RuDN-L (assuming 2 pieces only; see my previous post) will give equal / a bit more HP. You're better off enhancing RuDN-L from scratch than to transfer RDN-L -> IDN-L -> RuDN-L. It's a bit of a dilemma since you'd probably want RDN-L Top and Bottom in order to clear RuDN HC, but it would also be inefficient in terms of gold since you'll upgrade afterwards. I would still advocate RDN-L in most cases if your (future) team rotates RuDN-L wraths by priority like I do with my team (I'm not taking any RuDN-L wraths from the chests since everyone else's upgrades are more important than mine). In this sense, your RDN-L will possibly serve you long enough to be worth the cost (debatable).

As for the order, Top > Bottom > Hat > Shield > Flail > Shoes > Gloves should be rather efficient.

And as I always say to those going down the RDN-L route: you need to not overestimate your ability to face-tank hits. View your own mortality realistically: your combined defense and HP will be just a bit higher than a Gladiator in full IDN-L (non-evolved). If you go down this path, you really need to work on your ability to reliably block and dodge attacks. If you doubt your ability / motivation to do this, I would just recommend going with IDN-L instead. RuDN HC is merciless to any mistakes you may make regarding dodging and / or blocking. I have seen far too many Guardians over the years who have this "I'm a Guardian, therefore I can just face-roll everything" attitude. I would even say that the majority of Guardians have this attitude.

View Postjshak28, on 23 May 2017 - 10:24 AM, said:

Are you using the Racing Costume set? the gloves alone gives 10% HP bonus and Upper can give 8% Vit.

It's a bit more complicated than that for me. I have decided not to invest in any new costume as Unique costumes are just around the corner (perhaps they may never come to SEA at this rate, but I will just keep waiting for a while). The Unique costumes are a win-win situation for me, as I get to keep the looks of my current costume (which is to me, the best costume design so far), along with better stats than the Racing costume.

@Ameron

I would actually like to know what your per-stage DPS is. I do not think that that screenshot is an accurate representation of your DPS as there are several mechanics where you cannot DPS (or DPS freely like everyone else) since you have to lure, bait, or buff. One example would be baiting Tail Swipe. DPSing freely then would be suicidal.

Edited by Riuga, 23 May 2017 - 03:27 PM.


#280 Ameron

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 07:34 PM

View PostRiuga, on 23 May 2017 - 03:07 PM, said:


@Ameron

I would actually like to know what your per-stage DPS is. I do not think that that screenshot is an accurate representation of your DPS as there are several mechanics where you cannot DPS (or DPS freely like everyone else) since you have to lure, bait, or buff. One example would be baiting Tail Swipe. DPSing freely then would be suicidal.
hmm.. I only remember s1 (44m) and the dragon's death (42m?). I can tell that I do a lot more at s2 though. I don't really dps freely. Only when the dps window is open. My team barely triggers tail though. I only move to the side when Mamon casts frontal breath and continue dps and provide constant GF. I only do Overwhelm +click from time to time. I keep at least 3 bubbles minimum.

I don't really dps during s4 spirit mech. I just lure the big mob away. That stage might've lowered my dps a lot. I also provide constant GF during s2 "dark room end mech" and s4 30 mobs mech.